Chinked style versus Full Scribe

[pv88cch]

Hi There

We are new to the game and are presently researching log home construction. We have had dealings with a log home building company in Australia. They build handcrafted log homes (no milling). They offer either Chinked style or Full Scribe Scandinavian style. They strongly recomend going the chinked path and use a foam backer rod and a flexible, latex chinking material. They state this is 30% cheaper and more effective.

Does anyone have any comment and what are the key questions we need to ask them?

[Klapton]

First off, I should say that I'm not a member of the association, because I haven't taken the course yet, nor have I build my log home yet. But I read a lot, and here's what I can tell you...

It's good that you are going with hand-crafters. If you look in the Articles section here, you'll find lots of information about kit building, and how you really can't build a quality log home without making it by hand, on-site, regardless of whether it is "full-scribe" (chinkless) or"butt and pass" (chinked). But even with a hand-crafted full-scribe, there are problems with shrinkage and settling that you don't get with butt and pass. The problem stems from two things: 1) for chinkless to work, everything has to be SUPER tight. Once the logs settle and/or shrink, they aren't so tight anymore. Chinking takes care of this on a butt and pass, so it isn't a problem. 2) when you cut into a log on one side (chinkless systems invlove cutting into the upper log so it sits snugly on top of the lower log), you interrupt the grain of the wood, and now when shrinking and settling happens over time, it also WARPS the wood. That is, unless the logs have been fully seasoned before building. (Seasoning is the SLOW process of wood drying. Kiln drying, which the kit companies almost always do, is NOT the same thing, and leads to more problems with warping and irregularities in the wood).

Here's a picture of some folks who took the LHBA's course, and built their own log home using the butt and pass system. This is the page where they show how they did the chinking: http://home.mindspring.com/~kahle11/logstp22.html

When a whole-log, butt and pass home's logs shrink, basically the only thing that changes is the overall diameter of the log. So one MIGHT have to touch up the chinking. But most people don't. Their suggestion of using a flexible, latex-based chinking is based on the fact that there will be some shrinkage of the logs, and a flexible chinking is less likely to pull away from the logs and look "unsightly". A lot of this just depends on taste. Mortar chinking breathes more, making it less likely that moisture might collect inside the chinking causing rot. It might pull away from the logs a bit from shrinkage, and some might not like the look of this. But some folks like the rustic look it gives. And holding a lit candle by the crack on a windy day will tell you immediately if that chinking actually needs to be fixed or not, or whether it's purely cosmetic.

As for a list of questions... hmmm... I'm not sure. Hopefully someone with more knowledge and experience than I will post, and help you out. (And either confirm or correct what I've posted!)

[adubar]

Welcome pv88cch,

One possible reason that the company you are dealing with is driving you toward the use of chinking may be the results they've been getting with their full scribe chinkless methods--generally this would probably be seams between logs opening up, which probably require chinking at some point in the home's life--which is usually not what a home buyer wants when paying good money for "full scribe chinkless."

That being said, you want to ask about long term maintenance, checking and splitting of logs, rot and insect resistance, how their notching methods hold up over time and ask the names and contact information of customers that they've built for--try to make arragements to see those homes with the owners--the older the better. Also, very very important, get the builder (and their previous customers) to tell you about how log settling is dealt with in the home design and in real-life. Many builders take short cuts in building and will "engineer" several stop gaps that the home owner must be aware of so that their windows and doors are not crushed by the settling walls (this is a fact in 90% or more "hand crafted" notched homes). Time equals money for the builder and the techniques they use to limit their labour costs and build time will cost you in maintenance and possible headaches in the future. A properly built and seasoned notched (or full scribe chinkless) log home will not need jacks and false headers to compensate for log settling, as they will be built and allowed to settle before installing windows and doors (this may take several years wait--which most builders will not do!)


Now, as for the chinking itself, the rubber/plastic stuff is expensive and maintenance is not cheap. The LHBA's preferred chinking method is cost effective and may or may not need maintenance over time (however, depending upon which building techniques and methods the company you are dealing with uses it may not be an option). Many of our builders chink once, touch up after a couple of years, for purely cosmetic reasons and then leave it alone (several never retouch or at least have been putting it off for 20 or more years with no ill effects!).


If you have ever thought of taking a vacation in the Great Pacific Northwest USA, it would be a great opportunity to visit Washington State, take the LHBA's class and see some very nice scenery and meet some great people too. If that is not possible, please make it a prority to see and examine the builder's product, speak to long-term owners of their homes and ask hard questions about longevity and maintenance costs. It ther builder has not been in the business for more than 10 years, look for another. A 20 to 30 year old example of their work would be ideal to see.

-Andrew

[loghomefun]

My guess is that they don't want to deal the the complaints when you have to add chinking to your chinkless house down the road as the seams become gaps. Full scibe is also the hardest to build I think, and the hardest to build right.

But I am not sure what you mean by a chinked house. That could be a saddle notch, or a house made with beams and notched corners. So even thought it is chinked, it could still have a lot of the potential problems of a full scribe home, the ones that butt and pass chinked homes avoid.