New to the scene

[Bruce]

Hello all,
My wife and I purchased a lot at the top of a mountain located in North Carolina and now we are int he market for a Log Home!! We are very excited but it is very overwhelming, everybody out there says they are the best at what they do. I personally would like to know about anybodys' opinion on these itmes:
1. Wood species? I am a fan of cypress...not pine, any thoughts?

2. Can anybody recommend a log builder that THEY have used? Somebody that they would use again?

3. Basement? For a second home is a basement really required?

4. I hear a lot people talking about building their own log homes an dnot using a KIT. What exactly is a kit? I do not have the time to build my own log home (SHELL) but will finish the interior. Am I out of luck in finding a builder that can give me a quality log home that I do not build myself?

that's all I got for now.
thank you

[adubar]

Welcome Bruce!

I'll try to put some answers to your questions:

1. Some builders swear by cypress others don???t have a problem with pine. I think the best advice is go with what is abundant in your area (cost is usually lower). The problems that some builders associate with pine probably have more to do with poor construction techniques rather than inherent wood properties. Unfortunately, builders like to blame the tree rather than their own craftsmanship.

2. You can check the local better business bureau as well as take a drive and find log homes you like and ask the residents who built them.

One thing you should do is familiarize yourself with traditional and modern log home building methods. Beware of ???hand crafted??? home builders that use short-cuts for construction (this tends to be very prevalent). Also, realize that ???kit??? homes come with many caveats, particularly around setting-up, finishing, and warranty.



3. The answer depends upon what you think you need a basement for. Most local building codes require some sort of space between the structure and the ground. This can be a basement, a crawlspace or any other structure that meets local codes.

4. The log home industry tends to define ???kit homes??? as milled log homes that are precut and shipped for assembly. Most use a numbering system, like old Aladdin homes from Sears, so they can be re-assembled.

Others, including myself, consider any home that is prefabricated, meaning any home that is pre-built, disassembled and rebuilt. Many ???hand crafted??? homes fall into this category as well. Fewer builders are willing to cut and build onsite---time is money.

If you find that your local builders don???t come clean with answers to your questions, consider taking the class through the association.

At any rate, I suggest you take the class regardless of the type of home you want. The knowlege you receive will be the best you can gain for making decisions about your investment.

-A

[Bruce]

Thanks for the reply but I am still confused. From what you are saying the "KIT" log homes from somebody like Lincoln or Southland are not worth the money or heart ache correct? You are saying that Pre-Fab homes are not built well, I tend to disagree but I will not go into that.

I need to know about log homes. I do not have the time to build my own log home from scratch but want a quality home. My question still stands, Am I out of luck when it comes to me wanting my dream log home because I don't have the time to cut my logs on site? You also say I could benefit from the class, well the class is $700.00 plus air fare and lodging which would easily cost over $1000.00. I would much rather put my wife and I through real estate school for that money. Don't get me wrong...I have been to the log and timber shows and have spoken to log builders but it is hard to spend $1000.00 on a class that takes 2 days.

Are all Kit homes bad? Probably not. With proper research and enough questions I think a future log home owner can achieve the impossible and get a quality log home from a KIT.
I would love any feedback on this. Thanks

[rreidnauer]

Hello Bruce.

First, let me say that building your own log home from scratch isn't for everyone. And, I would never recommend someone to do so if they really feel it isn't feasible for them to do so. You'll get plenty of folks here telling their views, but nobody is gonna twist your arm to take the class.

So, as for kit log homes, they all experience some design flaws, due to their method of construction. The flaws are quite apparent if you know what you are looking for, as evidenced by the way the factories try to solve them. To give you a few examples, the use of jack screws, slotted door and window frames, and caulks and sealers. Skip's style homes don't require any of these.

But, the problems aren't strictly that of the structure itself. Even if you did have a perfect kit, further headaches can come from it's erection at your building site. Namely, the contractors you hire. Many folks find the LHBA organization website while researching kit log homes. Others end up here after buying a kit home, and running into disaster. This link is to folks who described their horrors they have experienced: http://www.loghomebuilders.org/kit_log_homes_horror_stories.htm They don't work for LHBA and don't get paid to tell their stories. Their interest is in spreading the word to others of what can go wrong.

Does this mean that it's practically a guarantee that you'll have a crumbling kit house thats never completed by a bunch of inept contractors? Of course not. There's plenty of of folks perfectly happy in their kit homes. But you got to ask yourself, are you willing to risk that kind of investment?

I'm afraid you won't likely get a builder recommendation, as either folks come here don't have a large financial account or don't want that 30 year slavery contract and have decided to build their own place, or ended up here after a disaster as previously mentioned.

Make you choices carefully.

[KeithMN]

I hope I'm not out of place adding my thoughts when I haven't built or even bought my first home yet. I just thought I would add another man's opinion.

Every person's circumstances and desires that makes them want their own home are different and personal. No one idea or plan is going to fit everyone. With that said, I'm one of the people who found this website while researching log home kits. I decided that I needed to have a home of my own. The thought of walking so willingly into a 30 year mortgage depressed me. I wouldn't have the money or freedom to do many of the things I wanted to do in life, like travel and having the freedom to choose where I wanted to work without having to be so concerned about how much it pays first.

So, not being a conventional-type person, I looked into alternative home buying options. I even took a class on how to buy foreclosed property. After finding out all of the problems that can cause, I ran, not walked, out the door. I don't want a fixer-upper, dealing with other people's damage, neglect and mistakes. I want a home.

After understanding that, I knew that I have always wanted to live in a modest log home, so why not check out how I can do that? That's when I thought of log home kits, which led me to research them online. The first thing I found when searching Google was the article on this site about why not to buy one. I read it and the horror stories that went along with so many of them. I checked out other sources about kits and there were always so many more horror stories than success stories. Actually, I only saw one success story about a kit home a couple bought. I've learned to learn from other people's mistakes, so I abandoned that idea altogether.

I came back to this site and devoured it. "Me? Build a real log home? By myself? Uh... yeah, right. The picture hanging on my wall is crooked and won't straighten out." After reading this website, clicking on every link, and then checking out two other log home building schools (even one in my own area) I was convinced I had found the place that was going to help me fulfill my dream. $795 for the class, plus airfare, hotel, car rental and food is still less than what these other schools were charging. This school has more testimonials and pictures of graduates who built their own homes using Skip's method. In short, the integrity and honesty that exudes from this site convinced me that, yeah, even I, could do this.

The hard part is the patience to do it and do it right. But this is where I will apply the lessons I learned from the mistakes of others who were in a hurry and got less than what they'd hoped for. Having my own log home, built with my own two hands, with no mortgage, that provides the freedom to then live and work where I want to, is worth two years of my time and patience to do it correctly. My own impatience almost led me into a 30 year mortgage. Time is flying by in today's world. Two years are going to come and go anyway. At the end of it, I can either already be settled in a house that someone else built (and that was owned by how many people inbetween?) with a mortgage, or I could be moving into the log home of my dreams, built with my own two hands, mortgage-free. I am choosing the latter.

But that's just my story. I hope you find what you are looking for, Bruce. I truly do. If building your own log home is not for you, then I pray you find contractors with the same integrity and honesty that I believe I've found with the people here and that your dream home is realized. Best wishes to you!

[JeffandSara]

Hi, Bruce--

My husband and I originally looked at kit/milled log homes, though we now live in a butt-and-pass home we built according to the techniques taught in the LHBA classes. Obviously, we saw something that appealed more to us in this style and building ourselves, but we fully admit and understand that it's not necessarily "the way" for everyone.

As someone mentioned already, there are still aspects of the techhniques taught in the class that could be incoporated into a milled log home and still improve it. Also, I met a student years ago who actually paid their contractor to attend the class so that he could build them the house they wanted but didn't have the time/energy/skills to build themselves. In our opinion, there's no question that there is much more than the price of admission worth of information in the weekend class, even if all it did was make you more aware of the potential problems with a kit/milled home you might spend a lot of money to have built. But I know that it probably hard to believe, and I understand that.

My best advice to you in deciding on a builder and/or manufacturer is this:

The best way to know what you want/don't want out of a log home (and who you might or might not want to work with you on it) is to visit as many actual homes with actual people living in them as possible. I know that's often hard, but a responsible builder (like one we have in our area) ought to have something to show for all their work. And if they're doing a good job and building relatively trouble-free homes, the owners of them ought to be happy to show you around, or at least speak with you.

The reason I say this is that everyone's EXPECTATIONS are different. When Jeff and I were looking at kit homes, there was always something a little bit "missing" that kept us from being gung-ho. When we heard about Skip's home and the course, our interest was more than piqued, and when Jeff walked into Skip's for the first time, he felt immediately that THIS was finally the house with the qualities we wanted. Two days of instruction about why it's built the way it is, and hanging out there sealed the deal for Jeff. And I felt the same when I went a few months later. Style, stability, insulative quality, price, etc., were all in line with what I had in mind.

This is not another plug for the seminars. Honestly, my point is this.... try to find a log home that has all that YOU want and expect from a log home... and then do WHATEVER YOU CAN to get your home built JUST that way-- similar size logs, similar techniques, similar manufacturer and builder, if possible, etc.. That's the only way to get the same results. It may be very difficult to do, Bruce, but with the prices of even modest log homes (and the problems we've seen since living in an area with a lot of kit/milled homes), it seems like it would be well worth the time and trouble to do the extra legwork and research to at least try to raise the chances of getting what it is you want.


Best of luck to you in your search for answers!
Sara :D

[Bruce]

Thank you all for your words of wisdom. I hear you and will definitely do all the research I can before I make any decisions. One of the problems I have is that I am on the East coast and trying to get time off of work to do the class is next to impossible. I am a firm believer in getting things done right the firs time so if and when the time comes for me to make the trip I will find a way.
I will talk to log kit builders and see what they have to say. I will ask them the numbers of 10 people who bought from them in the past 1-3-5-7 and 10 years.
This log home for me is a second home, a retreat for when I need a week break in solitude. Saying that I am not in a hurry but I would much rather enjoy it sooner than later.

Thanks again for all the responses and I appreciate the honesty, the advice, and the stories leading up to your decsions in how you all constructed your log homes.
Bruce

[KateHunter]

Bruce, some of the advice dispensed in the seminar is also available free online.



I think this page in particular would pertain to your situation: http://www.loghomeinfo.com/wisdom.html



You said you plan to talk to kit builders. As it suggests on the page above, I'd recommend you write to potential builders, via US mail before you settle on any one of them. The old saying about a verbal contract not being worth the paper its written on is highly pertinent in this case.



best regards, Kate

[Bruce]

Thanks Kate, I will use this to help my research!!!

[adubar]

Bruce,

I thought I might respond to some of your questions that my post may have raised.

rreidnauer always has good and timely advice, so I think his comments are very grounded.

kit homes, I think he states it well. They do have their problems, which are not going to be evident to the uninitiated.

As for "hand crafted homes," unless you know the history of the industry (and the techniques that have and are currently used) or have a very good friend with experience, there is a better chance than not that you will be built a home with inherent (and expensive) problems--unless you do your research.

If anything, ask questions about moisture and settling. Ask to see houses the company has built. Ask the owners about their experiences with maintenance. Good constructon and building techniques should create a home that lasts more than a life-time and should only require the minimum of maintenance---persistant moisture problems should not be the norm.

Good luck!

Keep us updated on your progress.

-A