foundations

[Donnie]

OK, this may be dumb, but, I have been told that the only dumb questions are the ones not asked.
Why couldn't I put 6X6 posts in concrete on four to six foot centers for the foundation of a log dog trot cabin with 12 by 18 foot rooms on either end and a 12 by 18 dog trot?

[edkemper]

Donnie,

You could. Of course I'm guessing at the engineering specs of doing so. We have our way of building our homes. With personal choices and alterations. Many of our members will use stem walls and such. Many, including myself will be building on our (engineered specs) piers.

Personally, I'm exactly sure what a "log dog trot cabin" is. But would love to come along on your build if you'd like to share your journey.

[loghousenut]

OK, this may be dumb, but, I have been told that the only dumb questions are the ones not asked.
Why couldn't I put 6X6 posts in concrete on four to six foot centers for the foundation of a log dog trot cabin with 12 by 18 foot rooms on either end and a 12 by 18 dog trot?

You could do it with pier blocks and it would last forever... Do it 18x18 and you really got something.

[rreidnauer]

or sonotubes?

[Donnie]

or sonotubes?

WOW! hadn't thought of those! Thank you!

[Plumb Level]

Donnie,


Personally, I'm exactly sure what a "log dog trot cabin" is. But would love to come along on your build if you'd like to share your journey.



I had to google it myself. I've seen them, but didn't know there was a term for them. Its about like two separate structures, with a center breezeway, but one continuous roof over the structures and the breezeway.

I think they look really cool, they just have more lineal footage of exterior wall, than a single structure of the same square footage. Then a lot of roof, but someone building this way values that covered center section, and I think that would be really cool to see all your hunting gear, fishing gear, etc.

I'd definitely go square on the rooms to max out the sf on those. Go for it!

[John17three]

Here's a nice one!

3386

[Arrowman]

I like the look of it. In a warm climate the center could be useful for picnics and such. I just imagine at some point I would get tired of going up or downstairs in order to cross to the other side in the middle of winter.

It's not bad though if you need to build like an "inlaws" quarter or something. Provides some separation without being a separate house.

[Simpleman]

Donnie, I used 10" pilings at 5.5' ft centers to support log cabin and 6x6 to support porches. Necessity due to river flooding every couple of years. We spend more time on the porches and underneath the cabin than anywhere else. The shade is appreciated most of the time in this Mississippi climate.

I'll post a picture if I can figure it out.

[Simpleman]

Donnie, I used 10" pilings at 5.5' ft centers to support log cabin and 6x6 to support porches. Necessity due to river flooding every couple of years. We spend more time on the porches and underneath the cabin than anywhere else. The shade is appreciated most of the time in this Mississippi climate.

I'll post a picture if I can figure it out.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161216/3ac42ee4cae0c99de5f40c0a91b9ee54.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rreidnauer]

That's cool!

[TAB]

Nice looking cabin!

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

[ivanshayka]

Very cool indeed.

[Sheepdog419]

I spent a few weeks down in Pascagoula about three years ago. Beautiful place :-)

[Chief700]

I've heard there are no stupid questions. That said, I've sure met some inquisitive idiots. So leaning towards the latter, Is it possible to build in the BnP method on a Permanent Wood Foundation, and not concrete? I suspect not, but thought I should ask the experts.

Thanks, Be Safe,

[mudflap]

huh. If you can get an engineer to sign off on it, anything's possible... I'm joking! :) Seriously though, at first glance, it looks stupid, but I just did a web search, and shornuff, you can get it to pass code. So, that makes me the uninformed one. That being said, the website says it's been used successfully since the 1970's, while on the other hand, they've been using cement since before the Flood, so......

And even more seriously, logs aint 2x4's- mine weigh in around 5,000 lbs each, and I think we'll finish the walls with 56 of them. so, that's:
+280,000 lbs just for the walls.
+32 rafters @ 1500 lbs is another 48,000 lbs
+ RP 7,000 lbs
+ rebar at I don't know- probably 2,000 lbs
+roof - who knows- probably 75,000 lbs
+everything else (interior and appliances) 75,000 lbs
=pushing 500,000 lbs.

normal 2400 square foot home estimates to be about 62 tons. Mine will probably come in around 243 tons. food for thought.

[allen84]

I've heard there are no stupid questions. That said, I've sure met some inquisitive idiots. So leaning towards the latter, Is it possible to build in the BnP method on a Permanent Wood Foundation, and not concrete? I suspect not, but thought I should ask the experts.

Thanks, Be Safe,

I guess it's possible... I think I'd be more inclined to use sonotubes and concrete if you're just trying to save time and money. I'll be using slipform method with stone and concrete, and 55 gallon drums with the top and bottom cut out for the forms.

[mudflap]

I guess it's possible... I think I'd be more inclined to use sonotubes and concrete if you're just trying to save time and money. I'll be using slipform method with stone and concrete, and 55 gallon drums with the top and bottom cut out for the forms.

Allen- you said "I'll", as in "I will" - are you announcing your build? :)

[allen84]

Allen- you said "I'll", as in "I will" - are you announcing your build? :)

Did I spill the beans? I've cut a handful of trees in preparation for a little (real tiny) camp shack that will go on an existing little concrete slab. I need to make a foundation for the logs outside of the concrete slab. I guess I need to haul all the kids out to start collecting rocks for me at this point. I wanted to cut down everything that might fall on the build area before I officially start building. I'm getting close to that point. I just have to figure out how to safely use lifting logs on top of concrete or solid rock. Planting anything is tough when you only have a few inches of soil.

[misplayed-hand]

Did I spill the beans? I've cut a handful of trees in preparation for a little (real tiny) camp shack that will go on an existing little concrete slab. I need to make a foundation for the logs outside of the concrete slab. I guess I need to haul all the kids out to start collecting rocks for me at this point. I wanted to cut down everything that might fall on the build area before I officially start building. I'm getting close to that point. I just have to figure out how to safely use lifting logs on top of concrete or solid rock. Planting anything is tough when you only have a few inches of soil.

Just remember: https://www.tn.gov/workforce/employees/labor-laws/labor-laws-redirect/child-labor.html :)

[jrdavis]

Just remember: https://www.tn.gov/workforce/employees/labor-laws/labor-laws-redirect/child-labor.html :)

Man was *I* in violation of those rules when I built my stick built house years ago.
but I was in Iowa, so it was probably okay.

[mudflap]

Did I spill the beans? I've cut a handful of trees in preparation for a little (real tiny) camp shack that will go on an existing little concrete slab. I need to make a foundation for the logs outside of the concrete slab. I guess I need to haul all the kids out to start collecting rocks for me at this point. I wanted to cut down everything that might fall on the build area before I officially start building. I'm getting close to that point. I just have to figure out how to safely use lifting logs on top of concrete or solid rock. Planting anything is tough when you only have a few inches of soil.

1st,2nd,maybe 3rd layer:
-(1st drawing below): put the lifting poles on the concrete at the corners
-tie off each pole with 4 tie ropes: 3 will be staked to the ground, one will be tied to the bottom of the pole kitty corner. It'll be difficult to maneuver with all the ropes, but try to do 2-3 courses this way.
3rd or 4th layer:
-(2nd drawing below): use ropes to tie the lifting poles to the existing courses in the corners to stabilize them against the existing courses.
-Also tie the tops of the poles to the bottom of each of the neighbors

-Make your own pulleys like I did- cost you $45 each, but they'll lift 5,000 lbs easily- lots cheaper than the ones you can buy for $300, and easier to find than the antiques on ebay. You'll need 8 triple blocks, plus 4 singles at the bottom of the poles. -Depending on how small your logs are, you could probably use a 4 wheeler to lift them. remember: to figure the mechanical advantage, you take the weight you are lifting and divide by the number of ropes you can grab in your hand between the pulleys (7 if you do it this way). that's the weight on the end of the rope.
-buy 2 reels of 600' of 5/8" poly rope- some guy in Soddy Daisy sells it on ebay for $120 delivered.

3746

and

3747

obviously, this is the public side of the forum, but all of this info is available in the army rigging manual.

[rreidnauer]

I've heard there are no stupid questions. That said, I've sure met some inquisitive idiots. So leaning towards the latter, Is it possible to build in the BnP method on a Permanent Wood Foundation, and not concrete? I suspect not, but thought I should ask the experts.

Thanks, Be Safe,I guess the question would be, "why?" Unless it will cost you less, it's hard to beat a masonry foundation of some sort. In a code-free area, slipform/rubble & concrete foundations can be done ridiculously cheap.

Sent from my SM-G928G using Tapatalk

[Mosseyme]

I wish I had thought of the 50 gallon drum idea. If you wanted to cover it later you could just screw in brick ties before the concrete and put up rock for a pretty finish.

[mudflap]

I guess the question would be, "why?" Unless it will cost you less, it's hard to beat a masonry foundation of some sort. In a code-free area, slipform/rubble & concrete foundations can be done ridiculously cheap.

Sent from my SM-G928G using Tapatalk

The 70 year old retired horse farrier who built the cabin I owned in Idaho did it that way- just gathered rocks off the local hillside and laid them all around the perimeter, then slathered them with concrete, and done.

[allen84]

I wish I had thought of the 50 gallon drum idea. If you wanted to cover it later you could just screw in brick ties before the concrete and put up rock for a pretty finish.

It will already have that finish. I will set the rocks in the form before I put in the concrete that will hold them in place. Look up "slip form masonry".

mudflap... That's kind of what I was thinking as far as rigging. It's going to be small enough that me and some friends can probably set the first two or three layers by hand. I have 4 chainfalls so I can work by myself with no motor vehicle. 4wd drive is usually required to get there on a good day. On a bad day, 4wd is parked by the road and I have to walk to the site. The trees are farther uphill so I can roll logs down to where they will be LoL. One of these days I'll get a tractor or skid steer to make my life easier.


Looks like there aren't any regulations for minors under 14 and I'm not employing them, just making them work. I'm good. 8 hours, no breaks. ;)

[mudflap]

Ha ha! I saw something like this the other day:

"how much was your allowance when you were a kid?"

"I was allowed to sleep there."

:)

[Mosseyme]

so are you going to spray the barrel with pam ,

[allen84]

Ha, might not be a bad idea! I figure concrete reaching the barrel should be minimal. And probably a chance I might just have to cut them off. It'll be a first for me so I don't know how easily they may or may not "slip" off.

[rreidnauer]

Speaking of barrels for forms, for those doing a (finished?) basement, how cool would a stack of wooden barrels be, for the center RPSL column? Slipped over rebar, fill with 'crete, then just leave the barrels! Would take some figuring, making sure they stay aligned and don't separate during the pour, but if you pull it off, I think that would be an awesome feature.

Sent from my SM-G928G using Tapatalk

[Mosseyme]

Great idea Rod. It would be so cool. If you had big enough wood barrels you could slip them over the metal barrels as well.

[misplayed-hand]

Well I had pretty much settled on a different use for a barrel. But whatever your dream you can get them here: https://jackdaniels.summitmg.com/jdr/product.asp?pf_id=BFJ1281&dept_id=14500
Bourbon drinkers you're on your own.

My dream:
http://imgpond.novarata.net/uploads/2018/03/113175de58dfc9406e181e51f6b51bde.jpg

[rawson]

Barrels: https://lewiston.craigslist.org/grd/d/wine-barrels-great-shape-newer/6509204050.html

[Little Eagle]

Well I had pretty much settled on a different use for a barrel. But whatever your dream you can get them here: https://jackdaniels.summitmg.com/jdr/product.asp?pf_id=BFJ1281&dept_id=14500
Bourbon drinkers you're on your own.

My dream:
http://imgpond.novarata.net/uploads/2018/03/113175de58dfc9406e181e51f6b51bde.jpg

127lb whiskey barrel, no wonder they are so tough.