Modeling materials?

[LowKey]

Folks, any good (cheap) sources for modeling materials?

I've decided to kill some time while waiting on the Feb 2016 Class by building models of some of my design possibilities. I know I may wind up scrapping a good bit of it after what I learn in class, but up until that time I'd like to be able to tinker with my ideas.
Okay,. to be honest, it's not that I'd like to tinker with my ideas, it's that I can't help but tinker with my ideas.
I don;t exactly have a lot else I can do where I am with my limited spare time.


Right now I'm looking for some 1/2 x 1/2 inch square sticks......anyone have a good source?
I don't care about knots, ect.

..and yes, I don't care if they've been ripped out of scrap wood as long as they're actually 1/2 x1/2 and reasonably smooth.

[allen84]

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=lincoln+logs&tbm=shop

[loghousenut]

Why not use sticks? Around here Vine Maple and Hazelnut twigs seem to grow just right.

[eduncan911]

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=lincoln+logs&tbm=shop

LOL

Seriously though, no matter the designs you have in mind, even square and looking at a lot of the pics here - it will all, 100% completely and utterly change once you take the class and realize this and that.

[Tracyblott]

You can get wooden dowels pretty cheap at hobby lobby.

[rreidnauer]

Hey Lego! Get on this potentially profitable niche market.

[eduncan911]

You can get wooden dowels pretty cheap at hobby lobby.
I've priced Hobby Lobby and Michael's and they come out well over $100 for the set (building 1/2" = 1 foot scale).

FYI, Michael's can order in bulk with a discount if you talk with the manager. Where brings it down to about the same cost as Hobby Lobby (a tad cheaper, if worth the effort).

I've been pricing in eBay as well and isn't as cheap as you'd think.

Part of me wants to just invest into a lathe (sp ck) to make my own dowels. At least I can get some of my money back when selling it.

[rreidnauer]

Part of me wants to just invest into a lathe (sp ck) to make my own dowels. At least I can get some of my money back when selling it.
Spelling correct! And you could even turn your dowels with 1:120 taper. :-)

If you are serious though, get a metal lathe. It would work so much better for turning dowels.

[Tracyblott]

Jeez price must have gone for some reason I used to buy the to make hat racks and I paid like 2 bucks a stick.

[Tracyblott]

Online at Walmart. http://www.walmart.com/ip/33397274?wmlspartner=wlpa&adid=22222222228022679107&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=40948194272&wl4=&wl5=pla&wl6=78889834472&veh=sem

[Tracyblott]

Jeez I hadn't given any thought to how many dowels it would take, that would be alot more than I'd be willing to spend on just a model.

[LowKey]

Why not use sticks? Around here Vine Maple and Hazelnut twigs seem to grow just right.

Because there are almost no trees here. I'm at work, not at my place in AK.
Here wood has to be brought in by ship, just like 99% of the food here.
Even masonry sand for cement has to be brought in by ship, the stuff here is too fine (like talcum powder) to be used in cement.

[rckclmbr428]

Google sketch up

[edkemper]

I don't know if you can tell but everyone answering your question is doing it with a big smile on their faces. We all asked the same types of questions before we took the class. What we all know that you don't? Nothing you are thinking of before class will be the same after class. Steve and E have a habit of screwing up all your pre-class ideas. We've all been there. But playing is part of the fun part.

[allen84]

edkemper is right... I honestly prefer 2D. You won't feel so bad to throw a piece (or 50-100) of graph paper in the trash.

And, you can put a lot more ideas and features on paper way faster than you can a scale model.

[eduncan911]

Spelling correct! And you could even turn your dowels with 1:120 taper. :-)

If you are serious though, get a metal lathe. It would work so much better for turning dowels.

You know, I may just do that now.

I took the family out into the property today for the first time (remember, right of way and 1/4 road I got the other guy to build to get to my property). Seeing my 4yr old daughter gleefully smile jumping around in the woods - first time ever in any woods. And I got to say, "see this tree? This is your tree!"

Sorry, got off topic... I was out there today and saw several 10 foot+ branches and scrap wood from the Red Oak laying out in the property. Beautiful wood...

...that a metal lathe would be awesome to use on. ;)

EDIT: never mind. Just Googled prices for these things. Whoa.

[LowKey]

edkemper is right... I honestly prefer 2D. You won't feel so bad to throw a piece (or 50-100) of graph paper in the trash.

And, you can put a lot more ideas and features on paper way faster than you can a scale model.

Actually, no.
<slight rant follows>


Over the last 1-15 years or so I've probably spent a few thousand hours drawing up ideas for my home. Most were for an RC underground home when I was checking into properties in northern Maine and northern Idaho. I had absolutely zero qualms about tossing all of that when I lucked into getting my property in AK. While the slope on the property would have been great for the original build, the ammount of rain and the expense of getting that much concrete to the site.....:eek:

So on the off chance I do decide to scrap most of my previous concepts, fine. But I doubt that's going to be the case.

I strongly suspect I'm not the "usual kid" headed to class.
I've never given a tinker's dam for any sort of building code other than the laws of physics.
I've never given a tinker's dam for what "they" say.
I've lived comfortably in rural Thailand in a home that didn't have any indoor plumbing, where crabs from the rice paddies would run across the tiled kitchen floor at night when there were heavy rains.
I've lived in shipping containers, and I've lived in rather complex structures built from sandbags and gabions.
I've lived in old Soviet block housing that had been chopped into smaller apartments. Despite being "downtown" there was an outhouse in the central courtyard.

I've spent about %25 of my life living in third world countries where "store bought" is only for the very rich and where everyone else has to be creative.


So while I'm really looking forward to the class and I expect to learn quite a lot of new stuff, I'm not coming into this with the typical middle class idea of what a home is or should be. I'll be glad to pick up any pointers on "re-purposing stuff", but the concept isn't alien to me.


At the moment I want to play around with sticks to make a model in order to better visualize some of the possible layouts. Paper, sketch up, and even Punch don't quite give the same visual perspective.




Now, LHN has a very nice sig line, "Every time I have strayed from the teachings of Skip Ellsworth it has cost me money."
I've also read the pithy quote, "If your going to be stupid it helps to be tough, which is quite true as well.
I grasp what he's saying, and I don't doubt it one bit. I also know that I'll happily <read:stubbornly> spend a bit more to get what I want vs "close enough" for some things. Not every thing, but some things.
For example, I grasp the added complexity and hassle of a hip roof vs gable. But if I decide, based on climate and other factors, a hip roof is what will best suit the climate then that's what I'll use, and if it take an extra $5k and an extra few weeks of work, so be it. TANSTAAFL*, everything is a trade off.

Honestly, I can physically live out of a 10x10 one room structure for years. 4Ft stem walls, steep pitched roof. Cheap, easy to put up, could be done to last for centuries for very little cash. I could do one in AK; I don't have building codes, building permits, or any other bureaucratic BS to put up with. But it's not what I want. I don't want McMansion, either.

I'm coming to class to learn about the technique, and I'm thrilled about the other bene's for members. I'm already about as divorced from modern American preconceptions of what a house is or should be, and I already have a healthy disregard for following arbitrary rules.


<sigh>
Look, sorry if this has come off like blowing up in your face. That wasn't my intent.
I'm just getting a bit fed up with the "your whole life will change after the class" shtick.
While I can see where that might be the norm for most folks, I'm already about as cynical as can be about the building industry in the US, consumer culture, "keeping up with the Jone's" , and building codes.
The class may turn out to be graduate work for me, but it's not going to be a revelation.


Again, apologies if this seemed a bit harsh, but all I had originally asked was if anyone knew of a decent source to order for 1/2 x 1/2 inch sticks for me to
order so I could play around with modeling a few ideas. When you ask how to build a one bedroom cabin do you want responses telling you you should build a 4 bedroom brick home because it has better resale value?
<sigh>
Don't we all already have to deal with enough double guessing by folks who assume they know what we want better than we do?
<sigh>

*There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.

[LowKey]

Should read 11-15 years.
Wish there was an edit function.

[LowKey]

You know, I may just do that now.

I took the family out into the property today for the first time (remember, right of way and 1/4 road I got the other guy to build to get to my property). Seeing my 4yr old daughter gleefully smile jumping around in the woods - first time ever in any woods. And I got to say, "see this tree? This is your tree!"

Sorry, got off topic... I was out there today and saw several 10 foot+ branches and scrap wood from the Red Oak laying out in the property. Beautiful wood...

...that a metal lathe would be awesome to use on. ;)

EDIT: never mind. Just Googled prices for these things. Whoa.
Congratulations.
Owning land is a whole different experience form renting!

[loghousenut]

I thought my idea about using sticks was right up your alley. Bread sticks would be cheap n easy too.


My life changed after class. Nothing monumental or Earth shattering but it was a welcome change nonetheless. Perhaps it was youth that made that change possible. Maybe if I want to class now I'd take less away from it... Who knows. Sure glad I went. It was a long time ago. I owe Skip a lot.

[LowKey]

I thought my idea about using sticks was right up your alley. Bread sticks would be cheap n easy too.


My life changed after class. Nothing monumental or Earth shattering but it was a welcome change nonetheless. Perhaps it was youth that made that change possible. Maybe if I want to class now I'd take less away from it... Who knows. Sure glad I went. It was a long time ago. I owe Skip a lot.

No doubt.
I'm not trying to denigrate what the class has to offer, and I'm not suggesting that I won't walk away from it with a new perspective and lots of new ideas.

On the other hand it's more than a touch irritating to ask. "Anybody know where I can get a good deal on some 1/2/x1/2 inch sticks" and be told "don't bother, noting you can think of now will matter. Only after class can you have worthwhile ideas".

Seriously. If I wasn't interested in learning what the class has to offer I'd use the time to visit my wife. Vegas has no appeal to me, I've had enough of deserts.


Once more, sorry if this has come across as negative..I really do appreciate folks offering knowledge to address questions I may have. I'm just not as appreciative of receiving answers to questions which I haven't asked. :D

[edkemper]

Lowkey,

You fit in here more than you realize. You don't stand out as anything less than or different from the rest of us. You'll find that out once you get to the other side. This family is like no other.

[eduncan911]

^- Ed said it best. You'll fit right in much more than you think with equally minded folks and the same goals.

The class isn't just about the technique. It's how to structure your life around the home. No mortgage, complying to building codes inexpensively, how to best source materials from free and up to remove the burden of the bank, how to plan for it to last to pass it down to grand kids (they really go the extremes here, starting from the best/ideal techniques on how to do something, and going down from there), etc. There's a lot we can't share here on the public side. But basically, these big decisions do affect your life's goals; hence, the reasons you keep hearing "your life will change." True, your situation does seem more disconnected from most with the American Dream (and bank notes that go with it). That aligns you more with us actually already.

I know you said you don't have building codes in your area. Hats off to you for finding that patch of US soil! But most of us do have to make some B.I. happy one way or another and parts of the class focus on that. It's valuable knowledge to have if one ever decided to set foot in such oversight.

In class they go over key reasons why building a scale model is recommended. One is to practice the techniques learned in class. So... If you were to build one now, you may be building another with the techniques from class.

[allen84]

Come on now, I was the first to offer a response to your question ;) I don't think anyone is suggesting to forget your plans at all... But be prepared to learn and consider some different perspectives. After all, if we knew it all we wouldn't need the class to begin with.

For me, there was things taught in the class that came into play as far as floor plan layout that changed some of the things I had in mind. And I'm thinking the planning stages are different for us all. Some folks, I'm sure, are more visual and hands on than others. Most are probably far more organized than me. Everyone has a different outcome they expect to achieve. I personally don't have the patience or attention span to make a model, so my hat's off to those who do!

If Vegas doesn't appeal to you now and you've never been there, then it'll probably be even less appealing by the time you leave. Neat place to go one time. I thought it was a rather gross city. It certainly exceeded my expectations. I wish I could have spent some time seeing the rest of state.

[Mosseyme]

I am a want to see it person also, and I sure get the impatience of being away and having time and can't get your hands dirty doing what you really want to be doing. I went so far as to gather a bunch of sticks 3-4' long and 3" butts. Got them peeled and ready with the grand kids. Then suddenly we were into breaking ground, digging basement, pouring footers, stacking ICF, pouring basement, building floor, stacking logs, milling lumber, lifting RPSLs, lifting the 57' RP. milling lumber, planing lumber, mounting log rafters, decking over the rafters, waterproofing for winter then back at building up roof and insulating it, decking the buildup, waterproofing it, then ahhhhh, metal on the roof. I guess I need to go get rid of that bunch of sticks. Doing a model is really great way to help avoid mistakes probably would have done a few thing different if I had done that model. I wish I could ship you my sticks but my sister just shipped her son in India an 8lb box for just over $300. Not sure that kind of cost would be worth it.

[rreidnauer]

You know, I may just do that now.

...that a metal lathe would be awesome to use on. ;)

EDIT: never mind. Just Googled prices for these things. Whoa.Craigslist and patience.

I will get one, but don't have anywhere to put it at the moment. The storage trailer is harder on some of my tools than I care for, and you don't want rust on a lathe.

[eduncan911]

Craigslist and patience.

I will get one, but don't have anywhere to put it at the moment. The storage trailer is harder on some of my tools than I care for, and you don't want rust on a lathe.

That's a great idea.

Just thought of idea myself... Ask to "rent one" for an afternoon. Found several local to me so I'm going to email them asking if I can drop by with some beer for an afternoon.

Found one lathe that goes up to 5 feet! Bed frame!!!

-E

[rckclmbr428]

Bed frame? How short are you?

[eduncan911]

Bed frame? How short are you?

Was thinking of the head/footer boards. :P

[LowKey]

first time ever in any woods
If Vegas doesn't appeal to you now and you've never been there, then it'll probably be even less appealing by the time you leave. Neat place to go one time. I thought it was a rather gross city. It certainly exceeded my expectations. I wish I could have spent some time seeing the rest of state.

I passed through Vegas a few dozen times back in the late 90's and early 00's, didn't stop as it had no interest to me. I'm not going to criticize folks who find it to be their cup of tea, but I know the odds are in favor of the house and the purpose of all the lights and glitter is to get me to part with my money.
I'm not sticking my nose in the air at those who want to enjoy all that the place has to offer, I'm just not into glitz and empty promises.


I may get a few chips and sit at a table in order to enjoy free food and drinks, if that's still the way the run the show. I'm just not going to put more into chips than I'd pay for a blue plate special. ;)

[LowKey]

That's a great idea.

Just thought of idea myself... Ask to "rent one" for an afternoon. Found several local to me so I'm going to email them asking if I can drop by with some beer for an afternoon.

Found one lathe that goes up to 5 feet! Bed frame!!!

-E

I've a PDF file on how to build a multi-machine from odds and ends (based off scrapped engine blocks) . Anyone interested?

[loghousenut]

I may get a few chips and sit at a table in order to enjoy free food and drinks, if that's still the way the run the show. I'm just not going to put more into chips than I'd pay for a blue plate special. ;)

There must be cheaper ways to get free drinks and food.

What kinda multi-machine?

[LowKey]

There must be cheaper ways to get free drinks and food.

What kinda multi-machine?

The file is only 2.8 mb.

It's a multi-machine, for metal working.

[LowKey]

The file is only 2.8 mb.

It's a multi-machine, for metal working.

Part of what I meant to say is if you'll tell me how to get the file to you, I'll send it asap and you can look it over yourself.

[allen84]

LowKey, sent you a message... Got my gears turning about what all could be done with a scrap (or running) engine. I'd like to take a look at what you are talking about.

[Tracyblott]

Was thinking of the head/footer boards. :P
Head to foot your 4ft tall?

[loghousenut]

Well he found a way to send the plans to that multi-machine to me. Pretty darned impressive!


What is more impressive is how quickly LowKey discovered how to hijack his own thread. Hasn't even gone to class yet and he's already showing skills that Tom n Bo took months to fully master!

[allen84]

Thanks! I skimmed it over. Some great ideas in there. I already had the vision of my old 48 chevy frame and drivetrain running a circle sawmill (already has 4 speeds and reverse!). Now I see it running a circle saw, table saw, edger, planer, shaper, drill press maybe more. Now if I could just talk my neighbor out of some scrap vehicles before they rot away...

[eduncan911]

OK, I want this PDF...

[rreidnauer]

Hmm, this has got me thinking, and may make Steve and Ellsworth want to bludgeon me with a rubber chicken for suggesting this, but maybe it would be a good idea to set up a FTP for pertinent documents?

[LowKey]

Hmm, this has got me thinking, and may make Steve and Ellsworth want to bludgeon me with a rubber chicken for suggesting this, but maybe it would be a good idea to set up a FTP for pertinent documents?

As long as I don't have to index them I have A LOT of files along the same lines.

It's not that I'm isolationist, it's just that I don't trust the rest of the world to be there every morning* when I wake up.


*or on speaking terms with me.

[Tracyblott]

I don't know if anybody has ever gave it any thought but I'd love to see some DIY plans on building a crucial saw with a 10 to 15 hsp Honda or Briggs and Stratton motor powering it.

[LowKey]

I don't know if anybody has ever gave it any thought but I'd love to see some DIY plans on building a crucial saw with a 10 to 15 hsp Honda or Briggs and Stratton motor powering it.
More than likely I have something to fit that bill, but I'll have to do some searching.
That FTP doesn't sound like a bad idea though.

[eduncan911]

Just found these:

http://www.greatbrandsusa.com/pack-of-12-round-hardwood-dowel-rods-1-dia-x-36-long-7316u-c-c-orange/

Best price I've found building at a 1/2" = 1 Foot scale. 1" dia dowels = 2 feet average log size at scale.

[LowKey]

Thanks Eric.

I'm actually looking for 1/2 x 1/2 square sticks. Easier to stack up,
I can only imagine the number of times I'd hit my thumb with a hammer trying to "pin" the "logs" using finishing nails :p

[LowKey]

Huh. Learn something everyday.

Never knew they sold "square dowels". Aways though dowels by definition were round.

Oh, and a pox on Lowes.....they're blocking my overseas IP.

[eduncan911]

If you can afford it, get an VPN service (like $10-$20/mo). You connect your computer/laptop to their server in the states, and it is like you are here in the states. Your IP will be one in the states. Your traffic gets routed through their server and out from their IP. There are several to choose from, but read independent reviews first.

Personally, I have my own home server and just run my own OpenVPN. I have my Android to auto-connect at all times when I enable LTE/Data (disabled the vast majority of the time). Windows, OSX and Linux all support OpenVPN software.

This is how my family and I can watch Hulu, Nutflix, etc when in Japan or Canada on our Windows/Macbook laptops and Android tablets.

I don't think Windows Phone supports OpenVPN though. Blackberry, Apple and Android yes.

[LowKey]

I've a VPN bundled with my Usenet , but got out of the habit of using it...slowed stuff down on my other box and old phone. I may have to give it another shot on the new phone and laptop.

Android and L. Mint 17.2

I'd say a pox on windoze, but I think windoze is a pox.

[eduncan911]

All Android and Arch here, server is Debian using KVM (I dabble in GPU computing from time to time with pass through). Two usenets overseas due to dmca.

[loghousenut]

Thanks Eric.

I'm actually looking for 1/2 x 1/2 square sticks. Easier to stack up,
I can only imagine the number of times I'd hit my thumb with a hammer trying to "pin" the "logs" using finishing nails :p

Don't nail your model together til after you go to class!








HhhawaahahhahahhhHaHaw!!!!!

[eduncan911]

Don't nail your model together til after you go to class!


That's correct. There's a technique taught in class for pinning. And part of the model building is practicing that technique. Also, it's there to show those that need verification of your engineering of exactly how it is pinned.

[GreenEyes]

Bought 1/2 inch dowels at Hobby Lobby yesterday for 99 cents each. They didn't have quite enough, and need to collect a few more parts to build our model.

[MPeterson1020]

Just curious... If we plan on logs that are closer to 18 inches, would it be better to use 5/8" dowels?

[ButteredBiscuit]

Just curious... If we plan on logs that are closer to 18 inches, would it be better to use 5/8" dowels?

If you scale your model to ½" = 1'-0" then ⅝" dowels would equal a 15" diameter log. I would go with ¾" dowel which would equal a 18" diameter log.

[MPeterson1020]

If you scale your model to ½" = 1'-0" then ⅝" dowels would equal a 15" diameter log. I would go with ¾" dowel which would equal a 18" diameter log.

Thanks so much!

[ButteredBiscuit]

You are most welcome!

[rreidnauer]

Or you could just scale your model to 1/2" : 1'-6"