Happy 4th of July

[BoFuller]

Happy Fourth of July to all. Have fun and eat well. This is an awesome country we live in (most of us). Me, I'm going to the quarry to get more gravel. Maybe a picnic later.

[jrdavis]

Thanks Bo.

We're in Omaha athte Sheriton watching the fireworks tonight.

Right after I get off work at the Base.

Thanks to ALL who serve, are serving and have served.

Also ALL you folks who supported the above.

JD

[loghousenut]

Ditto.

I'll be smoking a turkey and you're all invited.

http://www.hillsdale.edu/constitution/pdfs/00_Declaration_of_Independence.pdf

[jrdavis]

LHN,

do you get a pretty good BUZZ from smokin turkey?
hahahah

I love Hillsdale college.
JD

[panderson03]

too hot to spend too much time outside so we're skipping the carnival and parade. doing the picnic and swimming though, and the fireworks later. hopefully it will be too hot for the mosquitos to come out:)

ditto to what everyone else said above. thanks to all who served or are serving. this country's free because of you!

happy and safe 4th everyone!!

[LogSurfer2]

HAPPY 4TH OF JULY!!!

Our country would not be the great nation it is without our Servicemen and women....I am honored to be an American!

Have a safe and fun Fourth and say a prayer for our troops!

[spiralsands]

Our country would not be the great nation it is without our Servicemen and women....I am honored to be an American!

As a former 'servicewoman' myself, I have to say something about military service right now...Most people don't realize that the United States military services have been the most forward thinking establishments regarding individual human rights in our country. The military services, by the grace of each commander-in-chief at the time, instituted racial integration during World War II, 23 years before civilian law would and it established gender equality in work and pay for women soldiers and airmen in the 1970's, benefits that some state legislatures still argue about and threaten to veto to this very day.

The military is sworn to uphold the United States Constitution and the Constitution is the only document that gives every American his or her freedom. We, as civilians, should not fail our military by assigning it wrongful missions. The Constitution was written for the People and the People only. It is our only power. We should be extremely careful about what certain political forces are attempting to do to undermine civilian control of our military.

I am not being political but as well as giving kudos to active duty military personnel, we should think about how delicate our democratic republic really is and about how we must be conscious of protecting it from those well-funded international powers with agents in our own corporate structures who would like to undermine it and turn it into a country we would not recognize.

Living in central NY, the graves of many Revolutionary War soldiers are scattered about the many old cemeteries here. I honor their historically unprecedented service which gave all us a heritage that the whole world admires.

Frances

[edkemper]

Frances,

Unfortunately, this is not the day or the place to correct this version of the history of our armed forces.

We will agree that our troops are worthy of any and all the support America can muster. There is not one American that deserves our support more than those that fight for us as a military force. The same cannot be said for our military's administration. Their history is not as lofty as the soldiers.

Before we show too much support, remember the number of returning vets that are killing others after returning and far to many that are killing themselves, as a result of their service. Don't forget they are returning home at a time when they will find few jobs. Our troops deserve and need far more help than remembrance on a holiday. We are loosing far to many of our brave men and women after they return home.

But first and foremost, we need to remember and help our newly returning disabled vets.

Know what I mean?

[loghousenut]

Know what I mean?


Yes Ed, I do.



Quote from Spiralsands..."As a former 'servicewoman' myself, I have to say something about military service right now...Most people don't realize that the United States military services have been the most forward thinking establishments regarding individual human rights in our country. The military services, by the grace of each commander-in-chief at the time, instituted racial integration during World War II, 23 years before civilian law would and it established gender equality in work and pay for women soldiers and airmen in the 1970's, benefits that some state legislatures still argue about and threaten to veto to this very day.

The military is sworn to uphold the United States Constitution and the Constitution is the only document that gives every American his or her freedom. We, as civilians, should not fail our military by assigning it wrongful missions. The Constitution was written for the People and the People only. It is our only power. We should be extremely careful about what certain political forces are attempting to do to undermine civilian control of our military.

I am not being political but as well as giving kudos to active duty military personnel, we should think about how delicate our democratic republic really is and about how we must be conscious of protecting it from those well-funded international powers with agents in our own corporate structures who would like to undermine it and turn it into a country we would not recognize.

Living in central NY, the graves of many Revolutionary War soldiers are scattered about the many old cemeteries here. I honor their historically unprecedented service which gave all us a heritage that the whole world admires.

Frances"


By loghousenut....

My Dad talked several times about what happened when President Truman integrated the military. He said "One day it was "we and they" and the next day we were all one Army. It was tough to take at the time but it had to be done".

I wonder how tough it was for "they" as compared to "we". Dad died less of a racist and more of an American that he was born. Part of that was due to his experiences in the Military.

I HATE the idea of the Federal Government enforcing it's will upon "us" but I think Francis has more or less hit the nail on the head as per her reference to the social changes that have been forefronted by our Military. Please remember that it is OUR Military.

I must express a certain amount of shame that I feel in myself. I have, for many years, supported a political party that has strayed from its stated goals. When I now reread Our Constitution, I find that I have completely ignored the source of all the answers. Our Founders were faced with the same problems that we face... A lack of control of our destiny. The Declaration of Independence that they pledged their "lives, fortunes, and sacred honor" to enforce, and Our Constition, completely define our liberties and offer an avenue for redress of our grievances. We are Americans and oughta be plenty proud of it. I know I still am proud of it but sometimes I have a weak moment and wonder why.

Lastly, I would add that those Revolutionary Soldier's graves that Mossemey referred to... They were a bunch of criminals. King George would have hung every one of 'em.

Every once in a while I wish I was a criminal.

[spiralsands]

It was FDR that integrated the military. AND to the other guy, I don't rewrite history, I read it DEEPLY. If GI's are killing themselves it justifies exactly what I said about the appropriate mission of our military. You have to look at our culture and find its sicknesses and stop forgiving the faults of political agents because their mission suits you or your personal fortunes or religious beliefs. Take some responsibility for exactly what you site. You too are to blame if you don't recognize the symptoms. I'm saying...SUPPORT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE POPULATING OUR ARMED FORCES. If you don't, you support those that USE them for financial gain.

Let's not be hypocrites. And it IS exactly the day that we are suppose to remember it. It is INDEPENDENCE DAY.

[loghousenut]

July 24, 1948 President Truman desegregated our Armed Forces. Roosevelt did a lot of things that still affect us every day. He did not desegregate the US Armed Forces.

To me it would be like saying that President Lincoln freed the Human Slaves. He only freed the Human Slaves that lived in the Confederate States of America. Had the South won the war, we might still be segregated slaveholders.

Happy Independence Day to one and all Americans.

[edkemper]

Frances,

Just so you know, I have been fighting for equality for over 15 years. I spend a significant amount of time in courts doing just that. So this subject is intimately part of my daily life.

The other issue is equality in the military and when that will occur. What is the percentage breakdown of enlisted military then and now? Do those percentages represent the breakdown of our country? Then we need to remember when the armed forces were first integrated, they were still 100% segregated. "Equal and segregated" don't belong together. Few "regular jobs" in the military were available to African Americans. African Americans in the military "back then" were treated more like they were before the civil war than what was promised after the civil war.

As for re-writing history? Keeping in mind that slavery at that time was legal (we really don't need to argue over it being right or wrong at this point). What Lincoln was attempting to do was to take away the personal "property" of our citizens without just compensation. That is still the law today. Sometimes we forget details. Speak to African American soldiers of that era and you'll find they were rarely equal in any way, shape of form. (I am speaking of WWII African American vets).

The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was the first time we had a federal court decide "everyone" is equal. To this day, we still fight over who is included in/as being "everyone." How many new civil rights laws have been required over the last 50 years to include another defined group of minorities that needed federal protections?

No matter what the details, we owe all our vets everything. We owe our disabled vets even more.

[spiralsands]

Frances,

Just so you know, I have been fighting for equality for over 15 years. I spend a significant amount of time in courts doing just that. So this subject is intimately part of my daily life.

The other issue is equality in the military and when that will occur. What is the percentage breakdown of enlisted military then and now? Do those percentages represent the breakdown of our country? Then we need to remember when the armed forces were first integrated, they were still 100% segregated. "Equal and segregated" don't belong together. Few "regular jobs" in the military were available to African Americans. African Americans in the military "back then" were treated more like they were before the civil war than what was promised after the civil war.

As for re-writing history? Keeping in mind that slavery at that time was legal (we really don't need to argue over it being right or wrong at this point). What Lincoln was attempting to do was to take away the personal "property" of our citizens without just compensation. That is still the law today. Sometimes we forget details. Speak to African American soldiers of that era and you'll find they were rarely equal in any way, shape of form. (I am speaking of WWII African American vets).

The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was the first time we had a federal court decide "everyone" is equal. To this day, we still fight over who is included in/as being "everyone." How many new civil rights laws have been required over the last 50 years to include another defined group of minorities that needed federal protections?

No matter what the details, we owe all our vets everything. We owe our disabled vets even more.

Huh? I'm not quite sure what you thought I was talking about.

Frances

[edkemper]

Frances,

You were mentioning about the military's integration history. I'm saying it depends on who you are as to how well they did or are doing.

But bottom line, I appreciate you and your service.

[edkemper]

Perhaps I misspoke. Actually, the first President to partially integrate the military could be Lincoln. He was the first to pay them for their service.

[spiralsands]

Frances,

You were mentioning about the military's integration history. I'm saying it depends on who you are as to how well they did or are doing.

But bottom line, I appreciate you and your service.

I wasn't making any judgments about anyone's quality of service. I just said the military has been more forward thinking in applying Constitutional guaranteed equality than the general population. It's not even an original statement of my own. In fact, it was an Air Force recruiter who told me that in the early 1970's as I was enlisting as a member of a Civil Engineering Squadron. I spent several years in a Stationary Engineering job and also did work in domestic and industrial heating and air conditioning. Upon my honorable discharge in 1978, I found myself unemployable with my skills in civilian life due to my gender, despite my experience and a DD214 in hand.It's no wonder that a lot of young GIs end up going back to the military after a stint on unemployment. In later years, I trained in the TxANG for RADAR electronics and found my place in the FAA.

I'm reading the biography of General Colin Powell right now. He grew up in NYC and did not know racism in his neighborhood. He was an ROTC graduate of CCNY. After graduation he was sent to the south (Georgia) to do officer training at a time when there was strict segregation of 'races' in restaurants, housing and other services. He was a military officer forced to find "black housing" and was refused service in restaurants even while wearing the uniform. Throughout those chapters, he constantly remarks about how the Army family was accepting of people on merit rather than prejudices. That is an example of what I was talking about. Now I'm not going to critique the performance of General Powell. His biography ended in 1995 after his retirement and we all know he went on to serve in other capacities.

My comment about FDR came from reading another book about the years before and during WWII. It was during the war that the Navy finally accepted integration of ships at sea whereas before, black men were only allowed to serve the Navy in port. The Navy was always reporting back to FDR about how the 'experiment' was going. Also, it was Bush Sr. who put the first women on the ground in combat in Panama. I remember the moment I heard about them and to this day I feel an unresolved anxiety about them. I'm not going to defend or condemn the performance of these people, but if a woman wants to work on Air Traffic Control Surveillance Radar, the military will give her the opportunity that she would not be able to get anywhere else.

And that's really all I wanted to say.

Frances

[Kick Forward]

Anyone see the San Diego fireworks display? Epic.. for 15 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ifn8LJl5n0&feature=related

[mario kadu]

Anyone see the San Diego fireworks display? Epic.. for 15 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ifn8LJl5n0&feature=related

We live in San Diego county but we are 35-40 miles to the north-east. We didn't see it but one of my co-workers did. He said' "wow! With a start like that I couldn't wait to see the rest of the show" LOL

[edkemper]

The company has apologized and offered to return next year and put on a show for free, if the city will let them. They had tested the electronics before the show was to start and there were no problems. So far, they are puzzled and embarrassed. But I wish I were there to see it.

[rckclmbr428]

Awesome! Wish I was there to see it

[loghousenut]

I'd pay extra if they'd do the same thing next year.