Self-Sustained Living

[StressMan79]

BenB,

depends where you live. In arizona, solar is no problem. In GA, you'd hate life in the summer--it is hot and humid and you wouldn't be able to run a swamp cooler. (and they are basically the same latitude). southern exposure is required. a mild climate that doesn't take too much cooling is pretty good, and a good stove for wood burning is required too.

My place is mainly for summer living as there is a mile of dirt road that is steep and gets snowed in.

But cheers, you have found a home that is not trying to sell you anything!

-Peter

[lilbluehonda]

If you do more research you will find you can do things like run a Swamp cooler on Solar Backwoods Solar has a few different sizes that take very little power to operate 50 to 80 watts

BenB,

depends where you live. In arizona, solar is no problem. In GA, you'd hate life in the summer--it is hot and humid and you wouldn't be able to run a swamp cooler. (and they are basically the same latitude). southern exposure is required. a mild climate that doesn't take too much cooling is pretty good, and a good stove for wood burning is required too.

My place is mainly for summer living as there is a mile of dirt road that is steep and gets snowed in.

But cheers, you have found a home that is not trying to sell you anything!

-Peter

[lilbluehonda]

We can make self sufficiency easier with power we generate, but conservation is the key to power self sufficiency. Granted LED lighting is easier to read by than candle light. Power with dependable availability comes from integrating multiple power generating sources, such as wind and solar. I have an idea that may smack of a perpetual motion machine, but it really isn’t. I have often wondered if you couldn't use a water ram to move water up into a tank. You could then use the fall from the tank to turn small water turbine for hydro power generation. You are using the kinetic energy of the moving water to “Ram Pump” the water into a tank. The water in the tank then has potential energy released through small water turbine which in turn rotates a generator head creating electricity.
I realize the hydro-system would empty the tank, and the ram pump couldn't keep up with the flow demand of the hydro system. It wouldn’t necessarily be a continuous run system but one that operates in cycles. One when the tank is full, you are generating power, and off when the tank is filling, the water turbine is in standby not generating power, so on and so forth. It would be run for "charging sessions" to keep a battery bank charged, as the water is discharged through the water turbine. You might even be able to make the charging sessions somewhat automated dependant on the tank levels. It seems like it would be free power because the inefficient ram pump would fill your tank and gravity could return the water through your hydro- system back into the feed stream, so you don't run afoul of downstream use, like you would if you made a dam. It also wouldn't cause a flood, because there would not be a damn to break. Well just some idle thoughts that I think would work. Does anybody have any ideas why this wouldn’t work?

The power company around here does something similar,they have a reservoir in the mountains during the day when power demand is high they run the water down hill to turbines at night when it's low they reverse the flow and pump the water back,if you have enough water to run a ram pump then you'd have enough to run a small hydro,ram pumps couldn't lift the water high enough to work,if you don't have a lot of fall from your water it take massive amounts to make any usable power,even a small low head hydro needs 500 gallons a minute,there are many small hydro sites on the net most of them have fall tables that show how much drop and volume you need to make power and there are also many ram pump sites that can show you what a ram pump can do,look it up you'll see whats possible

[StressMan79]

If you do more research you will find you can do things like run a Swamp cooler on Solar Backwoods Solar has a few different sizes that take very little power to operate 50 to 80 watts

I was saying that swamp coolers work well in arid climates. Not well at all in humid climes. so GA would not work, but AZ would. This is due to the psychometric chart of water.



-Peter

[BenB]

I quit - I will go without any power if necessary. lol
No way can I grasp all this "stuff" --- my summers will require not much at all to cool but winters are like -20 to - 40F around
This whole solar thing may be more than I want to bite off I am starting to sense.

[lilbluehonda]

I was saying that swamp coolers work well in arid climates. Not well at all in humid climes. so GA would not work, but AZ would. This is due to the psychometric chart of water.



-Peter

I here I thought it was just the dampness of the air but after looking at the charts and graphs I don't know what the hell it is

[edkemper]

Peter,

You'll understand if I say I love what you bring to this forum?

[rreidnauer]

I here I thought it was just the dampness of the air but after looking at the charts and graphs I don't know what the hell it is

Now that's funny!

[StressMan79]

good thing you don't really have to know how to read it, you just need to know that dry air absorbs more water than wet air, and in doing so takes more heat. I included the psychometric chart cuz that is how I roll...

heat is heat, so if you are burning wood, you can still go solar, but with those temps, i suspect you live in Canada, eh? the problem is the further away from the equator you get, the bigger difference you get between summer and winter irradiation, so in order to have enough solar in the winter, you have to way outproduce in the summer. Luckily, in some locales, it gets windier in the winter, so you can offset the diminished solar with more wind--but you have to add a whole other system.

On an aside, if I lived in guatemala, I'd never think twice about going off grid.

[Mosseyme]

Being in the medical field Psyco was the only thing I got out of that. HA!

[loghousenut]

I was saying that swamp coolers work well in arid climates. Not well at all in humid climes. so GA would not work, but AZ would. This is due to the psychometric chart of water.



-Peter

Somehow Peter (Stressman) has used the load/reach capacity chart off of my Gradall 534C-9 telehandler to explain the relationship between sweat and cooling without air conditioning. I think he has pretty much nailed whatever it is and I'm pretty sure he's right. I agree with him on this one... Perhaps.


Remember, he's just climbed out from under his own GD car.

Haha.

[Bill LaCrosse]

LOL...you guys kill me! I use the old weather stone...
If the rock is wet, it's raining.
If the rock is swinging, the wind is blowing.
If the rock casts a shadow, the sun is shining.
If the rock does not cast a shadow and is not wet, the sky is cloudy.
If the rock is not visible, it is foggy.
If the rock is white, it is snowing.
If the rock is coated with ice, there is a frost.
If the ice is thick, it's a heavy frost.
If the rock is bouncing, there is an earthquake.
If the rock is under water, there is a flood.
If the rock is warm, it is sunny.
If the rock is missing, there was a tornado.
If the rock is wet and swinging violently, there is a hurricane.

[BoFuller]

Ed,

Another thing I read is that the floors of those containers are treated with some of the most powerful pesticides in the world. Ones that are not even legal in the U.S. Think about how they don't want bugs going from country to country, or destroying anything inside. One site recommends replacing the wood flooring if you use it as a place for food or making it into a living quarters. I just use mine for a garage for the tractor and the quads, so I think I'm okay. But I don't think I want one for food and supply storage.

[Timberwolf]

LOL...you guys kill me! I use the old weather stone...
If the rock is wet, it's raining.
If the rock is swinging, the wind is blowing.
If the rock casts a shadow, the sun is shining.
If the rock does not cast a shadow and is not wet, the sky is cloudy.
If the rock is not visible, it is foggy.
If the rock is white, it is snowing.
If the rock is coated with ice, there is a frost.
If the ice is thick, it's a heavy frost.
If the rock is bouncing, there is an earthquake.
If the rock is under water, there is a flood.
If the rock is warm, it is sunny.
If the rock is missing, there was a tornado.
If the rock is wet and swinging violently, there is a hurricane.

If the rock is missing... there are thieves around...

[BoFuller]

Ed,

Another thing I read is that the floors of those containers are treated with some of the most powerful pesticides in the world. Ones that are not even legal in the U.S. Think about how they don't want bugs going from country to country, or destroying anything inside. One site recommends replacing the wood flooring if you use it as a place for food or making it into a living quarters. I just use mine for a garage for the tractor and the quads, so I think I'm okay. But I don't think I want one for food and supply storage.

Okay, this was supposed to be in the 'log root cellar" thread. I forgot where I was.

[edkemper]

Thanks Bo.

[ronwoodcraft]

It's getting harder and harder to live self sustaining. Why? Let me give you a few examples. I just started researching what it takes to get a house number assigned to a property. While it may not apply to my state, I was reading where one state issues a house number when you apply to have electric connected to it. So, what happens if you build off-grid? Hmmmm.
Another example which will apply to me. My state now requires fire sprinkler systems. So, if I don't have city water, I have to have a holding tank, pump and power to run it. Will the state tell me my solar equipment is insufficient to run the pump? Hmmmm.
Speaking of requiring power, the septic must be a pressure type system. No gravity feed systems are allowed in PA anymore. I haven't even tested the waters yet (pun intended) about rainwater catchment. The state may demand I use public water or drill a well. (and back to the power thing)
For heat, they won't allow only a wood burning heating device. (the one true independent heating source) I have to install something that will require it's energy from an outside supplier, whether that be gas, oil, or electric. (though, the law doesn't say I have to use it)
I also know they are running public water and sewer by my property, and wonder how long until it will be required that I'd be tied into it.

It's sad to say, but true, independent, self-sustaining lifestyles will be phased out whether we like it or not. I don't see any way this will be avoided. There simply aren't enough people willing to live such a lifestyle to oppose the loss of independence's being forced upon us. The best we can do is get built ASAP and grandfathered in before it's no longer possible.

This is exactly why I don't know what to say when someone says "Don't forget to thank a vet for your FREEDOM."

[ChainsawGrandpa]

Ow, Peter! My brain hurts! Abbey had a hard time with those charts... Abby Normal.


The power in my area is so unreliable that people just shrug when it goes down for a while. I heard a noise last summer, it was the neighbor's generator. Didn't think I could hear it that far away. I had no idea the power had even been off. Gassifiers, and rocket stoves for cooking and heating water (it only sounds like deprivation. It's actually enjoyable but not as convenient as a microwave and electric hot water tank. Still, I don't mind), vacuum container for storing hot water. Propane heat w/ wood furnace (not yet installed) back-up. The propane is so cheap and has been working so well that the wood furnace is just for the propane furnace repair insurance. LED lighting. The LED lighting I have is great, but the new LED lighting is phenominal. Had my eye on a 22" LCD TV and 8 watt DVD player. The pair came to 38 watts @ 120Vac. "Sunshine to Dollars" show how to make ice for a few cents (ice, catch bucket, good insulation, and a Wal-Mart box fan will keep you cold when the temps go over 100F. Freeze the ice in a metal bucket with a catch bucket below it and blow air over the metal bucket. Automatic dehumidifier (ok in my northern climate, might be over powered by southern state humidity). Keep food cold with no power thanks to four mile island technology: http://fourmileisland.com/IceBox.htm (not yet installed) pumping water is not a concern, laundry is no problem, freezer is no problem. Really, my only concern is the blow dryer and table saw.

Somewhere I have a link for LiFe Po batteries. We now finally have batteries that cost less per Kwh than the good 'ol Trojans, however they come with a hefty up-front surcharge. My preference is still for the deep cycle AGM. My kindest treatment for wet cell batteries could easily be called abuse. They must be left in the cold, discharge from only occasional use, and be moved periodically. Sometimes they are discharged too deeply. AGM doesn't like those conditions either, but they can tolerate it a little bit better.

Also a big thanks for the solar panel link. I can build 70W @ 16Vdc for less than $125. At $1/W I can't begin to make my own.

G'pa

[rreidnauer]

Hey G'pa
That reminds me, I have a 19" LCD TV with built in DVD in the trailer. I was happy to see it draw just 34 watts when playing a DVD, but better still 0 watts when it's turned off.

I've been playing around with the idea of taking it apart to see if I can run it straight off 12 volts.

[lilbluehonda]

I did that with my computer speakers seems pretty stupid to have to take 12V convert it to 110 then transform back to 12V only problem is my speakers work but also hum

Hey G'pa
That reminds me, I have a 19" LCD TV with built in DVD in the trailer. I was happy to see it draw just 34 watts when playing a DVD, but better still 0 watts when it's turned off.

I've been playing around with the idea of taking it apart to see if I can run it straight off 12 volts.

[StressMan79]

I did that with my computer speakers seems pretty stupid to have to take 12V convert it to 110 then transform back to 12V only problem is my speakers work but also hum

you might try a "SEPIC" unit. You can build one for a couple bucks worth of parts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-...ctor_converter

I suspect that hum is from overvoltage on the electronic bits (a 12 V battery puts out >12 V at full charge). by running a controller on the voltage, you should be able to stop this.

[loghousenut]

Doesn't work that way Peter. Even when I'm hooked directly to the SEPTIC unit I hum. My Wife has tried for years and can't find a way to stop it. I think you just have to live with it.


http://www.musicmotion.com/product.htm?pid=621680

[HardmanGT]

Silly question, are you using sine wave inverters or modified sine? It's my understanding that the less expensive modified sine wave inverters are noisy and some electronics don't play nice together. I know that my laptop power supply always runs hot when using the mod inverter on my boat.

[BoFuller]

I have been looking for some 55 gal drums for storing anything and everything from fuel to food. New ones have been going for around $100 but I found a local guy that is selling the metal ones for $15 each and the food grade blue plastic ones for $25. Friday I picked up 4 of each. I'll use 2 metal ones for diesel and 2 for gasoline. The food ones will get stocked with large cans of dried food, paper goods, etc. Now I need to get those root cellars made so they don't cook in the sun this summer.

[StressMan79]

Silly question, are you using sine wave inverters or modified sine? It's my understanding that the less expensive modified sine wave inverters are noisy and some electronics don't play nice together. I know that my laptop power supply always runs hot when using the mod inverter on my boat.

that is true, but I think he was running speakers directly off batteries, so no inverter.

[StressMan79]

oh, and I think we all can agree that LHN is a rascal...

[stamic55]

you might try a "SEPIC" unit. You can build one for a couple bucks worth of parts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-...ctor_converter

I suspect that hum is from overvoltage on the electronic bits (a 12 V battery puts out >12 V at full charge). by running a controller on the voltage, you should be able to stop this.

Sorry to keep this highjack going, but you could use a 12VDC regulator from radioshack if you wanted to maintain 12V. It's less than $2.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2062600

My laptop speakers hum and they get the power from the USB port. I haven't taken the time to worry about it though.

[lilbluehonda]

Sorry to keep this highjack going, but you could use a 12VDC regulator from radioshack if you wanted to maintain 12V. It's less than $2.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2062600


My laptop speakers hum and they get the power from the USB port. I haven't taken the time to worry about it though.

That looks EZr than building one but how do you connect it?